Tag Archives: commercial bookshelf girts

Can I Correctly DIY My Pole Building?

I Have Limited Experience, Can I Correctly DIY My Pole Building?

Reader MIKE in WISE writes:
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“I have been reading a lot of your posts, trying to gain as much knowledge as I can. You are truly the Guru. I have a couple questions that I hope you can answer for me. The first is, how hard is it for someone with limited experience to build a pole barn themselves and do it correctly? Sinking the holes for the poles in the right spots, setting the trusses, and putting on the metal without leaks? The second is, how does one go about framing out the interior? Would I have to build walls along the exterior walls like in a traditional build? Sounds like ridiculous questions, but I guess it’s the only way to learn.”
Mike the Pole Barn Guru writes:

Thank you for your kind words Mike, they are greatly appreciated.

With a Hansen Pole Building, your limited experience is a benefit, as you have no preconceived notion of how to do it ‘wrong’. Included with your building is our now approaching 600 page Construction Manual, walking you through every step of assembling your new building shell. You also get unlimited free Technical Support, in an event you run across any challenges.

Most of our clients do DIY their builds. I manage our Technical Support Department and 90% or more of our work is due to clients who hired builders, who did not follow plans and directions, and now have problems!

A major fear is setting poles correctly. Given a diagonal measure of a 6×6 is under eight inches and you are placing it in an 18 inch or larger diameter hole – you are shooting at a large target and have flexibility to move it to exactly where you want it. Our Construction Manual shares some great tips and tricks for not only settling columns, but also raising trusses and installing steel leak-free. All are much easier than one might suspect.

In all reality any average physically capable person, who can and will read and follow instructions, can successfully construct their own beautiful building shell, without extensive prior construction knowledge. We have hundreds and hundreds of clients, every year, who have done exactly this. In most instances, our DIY clients end up with a far better finished product than anything they could have paid to have assembled.

By utilizing commercial bookshelf wall girts, there is no extra framing required in order to have exterior walls drywall ready. https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2020/04/creating-extra-work-in-barndominium-framing/

There are no ridiculous questions – so please continue to ask them all until you are satisfied you are making correct decisions for your new building.

Raised Floor in Flood Area, Drywall Framing, and Water in Holes

This Monday the Pole Barn Guru answers reader questions about post frame with a raised floor use in a flood area, framing for drywall in a post frame house, and post holes full of water could be bigger soil issue.

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Do you have a kit that can be used in a flood area to raise floor about 10 feet. RAY in HOUSTON

DEAR RAY: Yes we do – they are stilt houses and have to be custom engineered for each individual circumstance. Rear more here: https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2017/09/stilt-houses/

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: We’re considering post frame construction for our residence. I’m sill researching and learning. One big question I have is: why does is seem like most people are putting stud walls against the exterior walls of the structure? Are the existing walls not sound enough to support the weight of drywall or wood finishing? Is it necessary for running plumbing/electrical? Is it overkill? WILL in ISLANDTON

DEAR WILL: Congratulations upon considering post frame construction as your structural design solution. Sadly, most kit providers and builders are selling building shells based upon cheapest price, rather than meeting their client’s needs. With this low price, most often comes what is known as externally mounted wall girts – wall framing to support siding being attached wide face to wind on outside of columns. While this is quick, easy and takes little thought, it rarely meets Building Code requirements for meeting deflection criteria. There is a way to solve wall framing to be a one step process – bookshelf wall girts every 24 inches. This creates a very stiff wall structurally, provides an insulation cavity and requires no extra framing to add interior finishes.

 

DEAR POLE BARN GURU: Holes for barn posts were full of water. Installed drain tile and water ran off. Now the post holes are very soft and I don’t believe they will support the structure. Ideas? STEVE in Michigan

DEAR STEVE: If you place a 2×4 vertically in a hole and push downward on it and it just keeps sinking, you have a challenge going on. Your best solution then is going to be to hire a geotechnical engineer to visit your site and do a determination of how to adequately support your building based upon actual soil conditions. It may be able to be solved by use of larger diameter footings, or use of rebar within your slab (tied to columns), piers down to solid bedrock or some combination of these. Your building will only be as strong as your foundation, so this is not a place to mess around or guess.

Should your 2×4 above only go down a few inches, then you only need to remove loose soil at bottom of holes and pour concrete pads as indicated on your engineer sealed plans.

 

See the Pretty External Wall Girts?

See the Pretty External Wall Girts?

Readers of my latest two episodes are probably beginning to feel familiar with this commercial post frame building. As well as its challenges.

I will first point out something in this photo I find to be odd, although not (surprisingly) necessarily a structural deficiency.

Outside board on this building’s roof eave line is known as a fascia or edge purlin. A fascia purlin is defined (in ANSI/ASABE S618 “Post Frame Building System Nomenclature”) as, “a purlin that helps form the fascia of a building”. An edge purlin is, “A purlin in the most outer row of purlins. All fascia purlins are edge purlins but not all edge purlins are fascia purlins.” Looking at this fascia purlin, note there is a dark portion roughly 4-1/2 inches in width aligned with each wall column. These are truss ‘tail’ ends. This builder installed fascia purlins between truss tails, rather than across them as indicated on engineer sealed plans and our Construction Manual.

Effectively this should have made precut soffit panels all 1-1/2 inches too long, leading me to believe it is possible this building is three inches narrower than planned!

How fascia purlins are attached is yet another issue, as through nailing into truss tail ends was specified.

Now onto what is really an issue, not structurally, but from a functional standpoint. This commercial building’s owner is planning upon climate controlling it. As part of being able to effectively insulate walls, materials for commercial bookshelf girts were provided (as well as specified on plans by the engineer).

For extended reading on commercial bookshelf girts, please see https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/09/commercial-girts-what-are-they/.

As we have seen from previous articles, this particular builder was not too savvy when it came to looking at plans. I suspect they are neatly tucked away behind a rear seat in his crew cab pickup.

Barndominium: One Story or Two?

Barndominium: One Floor or Two?

Welcome to an ongoing debate about whether it is more cost effective to build a one story or two story barndominium. Commonly I read people advising two stories is less expensive than a single story. Reader TODD in HENNING put me to work when he wrote:

“I’m curious why “Going to multiple stories will be more expensive than building the same amount of finished square footage on a single level”? Everywhere I read it says it’s cheaper to go up than out. For example wouldn’t there be more cost with bigger footprint of concrete, in-floor heating, roof trusses, and more steel on roof? Thanks.”


Mike the Pole Barn Guru writes:

It turns out Todd has requested a building quote from Hansen Pole Buildings, so I was able to work scenarios from his requested 40 foot wide by 48 foot long scenario. I arbitrarily merely doubled his building length when looking at a single story. It may have been more cost effective to have done this exercise by going greater in width and less in length (as one gets closer to square, there is less exterior wall surface to side, insulate and drywall).

Included were colored steel roofing and siding, commercial bookshelf wall girts to create a wall insulation cavity (https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2011/09/commercial-girts-what-are-they/), dripstop/condenstop under roof steel to minimize or eliminate condensation (https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2017/03/integral-condensation-control/), ceiling loaded energy heel trusses (https://www.hansenpolebuildings.com/2012/07/raised-heel-trusses/) with ceiling joists for sheetrock, 24 inch enclosed vented overhangs, vented ridge and one entry door. In the two story version I added floor trusses and a four foot wide set of stairs.

In order to maintain eight foot finished ceiling heights, two stories requires a 21 foot eave and single story 10 foot. Engineered plans and delivery were included.

I did not include materials for a bearing wall at the floor truss center. Features listed above ran roughly $6000 more to go two floors. Also, with the two floor version, you will lose 50 square feet of usable floor on each level due to stairs.

In this particular instance best overall buy could come down to what you pay for your slab and in-floor heating. Labor to erect a single story will be less expensive (I would predict at least a $3000 difference). Some other thoughts – two story has 1/2 as much attic insulation and 45% more wall insulation. Two story (excluding interior walls) has 30% more wall to drywall. This added exterior wall surface will likely result in more windows.

Personally, I own three multiple floor post frame buildings, these are my considerations:

Accessibility roughly 10% of all Americans will spend time in wheelchairs in their lifetimes. My wife is a paraplegic and we cannot get into one of her son’s homes because it is a split entry. Two of her other sons have built ramps for her, but they also have multi-story homes and it greatly limits areas she can have access to. In our own shouse (shop/house), we added an elevator after her injury (elevators are NOT cheap).

Stairs in general – you are probably much younger than my 62 years, going up and down stairs gets to be a chore as we age.

Heating and cooling – unless each floor is on their own system, one floor is always either too cool or too warm. I put one of my own buildings on two separate heat pumps for this very reason.

In conclusion, whether one story or two, go with what best fits your wants and needs and your property. Love what you build and it will result in a happy ending.